Eönwë : A Handspan of Days

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AelKennyr Rhiano

Days have passed in the world of the Children of Illuvatar. The vessels of Arien and Tilion chased each other across the velvet sky for a handspan of days, and yet...

And yet, and yet...for Eönwë, once banner-bearer and Herald to the Lord of the West, in his mind, he is once more striding from the Halls of Manwë.  He is once more kneeling upon the hard stone of the sacred mount and giving full voice to his pain, his dispair, his loss.  In those days that followed, the Chief of the Maiar is no closer to understanding the separation from his Beloved Lord. "Who am I?" he had asked himself that day, sent from his Lord's side like a wayward and disobedient child.

"I am Banner-bearer. I am Herald. I am Chief of the Maiar, along with Ilmarë. I am the greatest of Arms in Arda." That is how he had answered. But he still did not know. "Who am I?" He wished, again, with a longing he never before knew, that  Ilmarë would return from wherever she was. He could find  her, he know. He could join her instantly, wherever the Maia was. Yet he hesitated. Truth, the truth hidden but unmistakable, is that he did not want to find the handmaiden of Varda, his own counterpart among the Maia. He did not want to see her face, hear her words; worse yet, risk her turning away from him. 

How many times, over the handspan of days has he driven this physical body to near the breaking point in endless sword practice.  How many hours did he sharpen blades, rewrap hilts, repair leather hilts, and run...by Eru!...run.  Like the wind across a field of grain, did Eönwë run, startling birds from their hidden places, frightening deer that tried to outrun the Maia, eyes rolling in fear.  He ran and ran and ran until he would drop, senseless to all else by the body's scream for air, for rest, for nourishment. And still he would but pause long enough to do what was needed to keep the body functional.

But even in running, he came back, back to Mount Taniquetil, back to the sacred Mountain, the place wherein dwelt the Breath of Arda. He never strayed from  Pelóri Mountains on the borders of Valinor.  He returned, again and again, body weakened, soul raw, over and over...to what he did not even know.

Always he had been the Voice of the Lord of the West.  It was his pride. His joy. His soul sang when he saw satisfaction upon the face of his Lord.  He moved with sure and steady confidence to obedience in all things. Was he not the one to first greet Eärendil when he reached the shores of Aman?  Did he not take up sword and shield when commanded by Manwë to lead the Vanyar elves in the War of Wrath?  When at last the Dark one was defeated. who but Eönwë was trusted to take the two remaining Silmarils into safekeeping.

How was the Smith any different from Melkor?  Clearly he is rebelling against the Lord of the West, styling himself better to know what was proper and right to do.  Long hours, with so little to do, now, has Eönwë spent, pouring over the encounter with Aulë, picking over the words exchanged.  How could his Lord not see, not know? So plainly is to be seen how alike  Aulë and Melkor are. Both were prideful of the creation of beautiful and novel things. Both usurped the prerogative of Blessed Eru and strove to make themselves as God over beings of their creation.  Perhaps at the time of the great Song, the Maker's heart was pure. Perhaps he even endeavored to quell his rebellious tendencies...then.  But long centuries have passed since the Singing of the Great Song. Perhaps, Mahal, the father of the dwarves, has become jealous and desirous of the authority and power of the Breath of Arda.

It matters not, Eönwë tells himself. It matters not.  He looks out across the peaks of the Pelóri. and the restlessness seizes his heart, squeezes it. He shakes himself like an work beast shaking off rain. Once me he runs, wind whipping in his wake.  Perhaps he can run far enough, fast enough to the answer he seeks, that will let him do that which he must do. 

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Curse of Eru's Cleric

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Dominique Darkwatch

Dominique Darkwatch decides she will do a bit of routine practice sword work.  But what happens is anything but routine.

After Dominique finished her morning prayers in the Sylvan cleric hall, she journeyed to the arena.  The startling recent appearance of several drow and Torgans at the hall reminded her that she was vulnerable and in bad need of practice with her sword to be prepared to defend herself.

She positioned herself near a practice dummy and drew her sword, the one that was blessed by Eonwe and imbued with strength and balance.  She had religiously polished and cleaned it weekly, even though she had not used it.

As she drew the sword, she noticed that it felt different in her hands.  There was something about it that seemed strange and unfamiliar.

Dom quickly dismissed the strangeness as arising from a lack of practice, and lifted the sword with both hands, poised to attack and slash at the dummy.  Again she noted that it seemed heavier and less balanced, but she steeled herself and prepared to attack.  She raised the sword and swung it in a downward arc, hoping to deal damage to the practice dummy.  But suddenly the sword seemed to swerve and instead of biting into the wood of the dummy, it glanced off and bounce right back at the cleric.

This took her totally by surprise and the sword's blade bit deeply into her flesh as if rebelling against its owner.

As a battle healer, Dom had experienced the bite of many hostile blades, but this time she did something that she had never done before.  She cursed and swore. 

"BURZIM-ISHI KRIMPITUL!"

What came out of the high cleric's mouth was, in fact, neither elvish nor of the language of any race seen since the end of the 3rd age.  She cursed in the language of the Black Speech. 


Even though she had never heard it, read it or spoke it before, she knew what it was the instant it rolled off her tongue and out of her mouth.  She suddenly dropped the sword and covered her mouth with her hands.  She looked furtively around to see if any were around to hear.  In her astonishment, she had momentarily forgotten about her wound, but blood was pouring out of her, and she saw her hands covered in it.  But she was not terribly concerned, for she was an arch healer of Sylvhara.  Healing is what she did and she had healed herself many times in battle.

Dom knelt down, closed her eyes and called upon the gifts of her patron Valie, Nienna, the ainu of compassion.  As she prayed Dom suddenly became aware that the familiar sensations of healing were very slow in coming and faint and weak, barely enough to begin to close the wound.   Gradually Dom became aware that the warmth and closeness she had felt in communing with Nienna was no longer there.  Nienna was present, but there was a vagueness that was never there before.  A distance she had not known, especially since the ceremony at Alqualonde.

She continued to lose blood through the wound that was not closing fast enough.  So great was Dom's faith that she had not bothered to bring any bandages or even healing potions with her.  She began to wonder if her faith was misplaced, and doubt began creeping in.  Dom concentrated again, only this time she called upon the healing powers of Este and was promptly rewarded with feeling her body bathed in a healing glow that closed the wound and stopped the bleeding.  She was still weakened and collapsed in her own blood, laying there, resting until strength began returning.

   
Finally she crawled to her feet, and gingerly picked up the sword, now dirty and bloody.  She decided she would carry it instead of sheathing it, and gradually her strength returned  enough so she could return to the cleric hall, clean herself up, take a healing potion and rest properly.

As she lay in the bed, staring at the ceiling and listened to the sounds of the crickets outside, she reflected on what had happened.  Something was definitely not right.  It was only when she resolved what she must do that she was finally able to release herself to sleep and the realms of Irmo.  She needed to take her swan Lu, and return to Alqualonde and consult with Nienna herself.  Hopefully she was still there.   And so that was Dom's last waking thought of the night.  Nienna would know what to do.

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Training of a Swordmaiden

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Carleen Luckstone, Shawn Daysleeper, and AelKennyr Rhiano

Olwe whirls around after deftly blocking her last thrust and with the grace of the Eldar, leaps back. Wiping the sweat from his brow with the back of his hand, he smiles approvingly.  She has come far in her swordscraft. He spares a glance over at Nole, seeing the sailor's expression as he looks on. Overhead, the Arien's vessel has made half its journey across the sky.  Birdsong breaks the stillness of the pause as the Lord of the Teleri pauses to run his tongue over parches lips.  He extends his hand, palm up and with his fingers, he beckons Elenwe. "Again," he says.

Seeing her Lord skilfully avoid her attack, Elenwe pauses to catch her breath. She is out of practice in her sword skills, and Olwe appears to enjoy making her strive hard in this practice. She hears him say "Again." as he motions her to attack. Trying not to gasp, she exclaims, "Please, my Lord, I need but a moment. May I fetch some water for you?"

Ever more cautious than his lord, Nole watched his king and Elenwe train by the waterfall.  His face wears a concerned look, and he hopes his lord did not notice it when he glanced at him. He would always defend his friends, but he tended to stay out of the training exercises. He watches his the pair.

Olwe studies her face a moment, and he gives a short nod of agreement  to the brief pause. "I am fine," He answers, ignoring the thirst. "But yes, we may take a moment."

Elenwe sheaths her sword and turns to Nole. "My friend, I am happy you chose to join us. It is good to be practicing the way of the sword again with our king." Glancing over her shoulder at Olwe, she tries to discern any hint of fatigue, but cannot. She smiles, thinking how much he has improved in a short time. "So much has happened recently, it seems ages since.... it happened." She thinks. Elenwe still found it hard to think of those dark moments of King Olwe's time of despair.

Nole smiles. "Your skills are remarkable! You have come a long way in your training." He claps. His thoughts then shift back to the dark time his friend refered to. It was an emotional time for them all. He shoves those thoughts away. "We have learned a lot since then, dear friend." He offers a cup to Elenwe to get a drink of water.

Elenwe accepts the cup with a smile at her dearest friend. "Thank you, Nole."  She climbs down the rocks to the water, reaching into the cool water to fill the cup. As she sips, she watches the water over the rim of the cup. Water always seems to bring her such a calming, peaceful feeling.  Straightening, she continues to stare into the rippling water. She then turns to watch her two companions. They have come to mean so much to her in the short time she has been in Alqualonde. Gratefully, she remembers the kindesses each has shown her as she grew accustomed to the Swanhaven. "They accepted me, as if I had always been part of Alqualonde," Elenwe thinks to herself. So different from anything she had ever known. "No one has ever accepted me so easily. They always..." Elenwe shakes her head. "No!" she says aloud, then realizes Olwe and Nole probably heard her exclamation. She repeats, "No!" to herself. She will not dwell on those in her past who showed her not kindness and love, but only cruelty and disdain. She turns and scrambles back up to stand with Nole and Olwe.

Olwe turns his head to watch her climb back up from the pool of water at the base of the waterfall, eyes widening a little at the emphatic "No!" which spills from her.  He watches her join them, curious but silent.

Nole looks up at his friend's words. He wonders what could be running through her mind. He notices his king's silence and nods. He then gets a drink of water himself. The sun was quite warm this day.

Olwe watches Nole, wondering at the sailor's silence. He had anticipated Nole asking Elenwe about her outburst, and frowns a little as he puzzles over the meaning. Reaching up, he dabs at the bead of sweat on his upper lip and turns blue eyes to rest upon Elenwe. "You have much improved, " he says quietly to her.  "And I have needed the exercise since..." he pauses and then continues on, making his voice as level as possible. " Since the incident."

The silence deepens and seems to encircle Elenwe, relentlessly drawing her into memories she has tried to banish from her mind. She can still remember the shrill voice of the woman she last lived with in the seaport. And the hand which struck out at her for trifling errors. The lonely nights spent in the cold darkness of the corner appointed to her for sleeping quarters. But, just when she despaired of ever feeling anything other than worthless, the beautiful swanship sailed into the port where she lived. Elenwe looks at Nole, remembering the disbelief on his face as he beheld her for the first time. She smiles. "Kind Nole," she says, trying to keep her voice from shaking. "Have I thanked you enough for brining me to this beautiful place, where I have the fellowship of Teleri like myself?" Elenwe glances nervously at the pair, hoping they did not hear, or won't comment on, her outburst.

Nole smiles. "You defend the few of us that have found their way home. Alqualonde feels joy to have another return here and bring light to us in these uncertain times. You have filled some of the lonliness in my heart: that is thanks for me."

 Elenwe smiles again at Nole's words. "Dear friend, my lonely heart was greatly cheered when you took me aboard your ship and brought me here. You are the family I always dreamed of." Turning to include Olwe in her broad smile, she continues, "My Lord, you are both my family." She hesitates, and then blurts out, "Please, forgive my outburst a moment ago. Some horrible memories were crowding into my mind, and I did not want them to linger. I did not realize I had spoken out loud until it was too late." Her words trail off into embarassed silence.

Gentle is the gaze the Lord of the Teleri turns upon Elenwe, and he gives a soft nod. Casting a quick glance over at the Teleri merchant, he turns his gaze back to the swordmaiden, for so she is becoming, and speaks as he reaches up and releases his hair from the bit of string which held it off his neck and out of his eyes. As the silver strands came tumbling free, he answers her softly, "There is nothing to forgive, Elenwe." He pauses and then continues, swallowing past a hard lump in his throat. "I know well how memories we would prefer forgotten can swim up from their murky depths in our mind and claim hold of our emotions."

Elenwe hangs her head. "Oh, aye, my Lord," she replies, "and I do not want them to darken the beauty I see here in the Swanhaven. " She turns to the waterfall, and then the sea, indicating the lush landscape with a wave of her gloved hand. "Everything is so beautiful here. And those who live here are beautiful, as well. Although," she says with a laugh, thinking of some of the newer arrivals, "they are not what I would expect for residents of Alqualonde."

Nole nods at Olwe's words. "I feel those memories upwell at times also." He blushes at Elenwe's description. "It is indeed beautiful. I have seen many lands on my travels abroad. They are interesting and remarkable in their beauty and culture, but I am always happiest here."

Olwe watches her as she gestures and slowly unbuckles his sheath strapped to his back. Walking over toward the fountain, he bends down and lays the blad reverently upon the ground, tracing the etchings upon the handle lovingly, caught for a moment in a memory of his own, cherishing again the moment the sword in its sheath was pressed in his hands.  He blinks away the image of the Maia Tilion, his eyes shining, his lips framing the words, "For you, Heart of  my Heart." Turning back to the others, he sits down upon the soft grass and waves his companins over. "Come, sit, please," He beckons.

Elenwe watches the movements of her King and follows his request to sit. She settles onto the grass. Eyes the color of the sea regard both his companions, then turn their gaze upon the training swordmaiden. "Elenwe," he calls her name gently.  "The utterance sounds like it came from a place of deep pain within you." He is sill and calm as he watches her face for her reaction.

Elenwe bites her bottom lip, trying not to betray her emotions. "Yes, my Lord," she says quietly, "very painful." She can see the calm in his gaze. There is none of the harsh judgment she endured in the other land. Does he want her to reveal? "There were not many who were kind to me in the other lands. So different from how you both show great kindness to me," she begins.

The wind began to blow a warm breeze, and in the distance, the raucous caw of seagulls could be heard.  Olwe nods at her words, urging her to continue.

  Elenwe sees Olwe's encouraging nod, and words now tumble from her lips. If she speaks quickly enough, perhaps the memories chasing her will have to leave quickly. "I was the only Teleri, as you know, in the areas I was for years. Because I looked unlike the others, and was not human, I was taunted, hated, and beaten by many. I was made to do the menial, dirty tasks others turned their noses up at." Tears fill her eyes. "The last one I lived with seemed to delight in setting impossible tasks for me and then beating me when I failed, as she knew I would." She closes her eyes, hot tears stiniging her cheeks.

For a moment, there was only the sound of the falling water beside them, as her tears fell.  Olwe sat forward and started to speak but stopped himself, watching the pain flit across her delicate features. Silently he willed her to continue, hoped she would at last unburden herself.

Nole shudders as he hears her tale. He has not known what she went through while abroad, only that she was deparate to come with him.

Trying to compose herself, dashing away the tears, she says, "The day Nole sailed into port, I had decided I would leave what had been my home and never return. I knew not where I would go, nor if I would survive. I only knew I could not survive there any longer." Turning to Nole, she lays a hand on his sleeve. "So you see Nole, you saved my life. Had you not offered to bring me here, I might have... have.... died."

Olwe's mind recoils at her words. His hands involuntarily clench as she speaks. His eyes drop to the ground as he listens, and he forces his hands to relax and uncurl. "Where were your parents?" he asks softly. "What happened to them?"

Nole gives her a reassuring smile and takes her hand. "Here you will not have such a life. You are home with your family." He then waits for her response to his king's question.

Elenwe lifts her eyes to Olwe's. "I know not, my Lord. I do not remember them. I was always told they did not love me anymore. The humans said that if my parents loved me, they would not have left me behind." More tears slide down her face, as if they will flow forever now that they have been released by her friends' gentle kindess.

"That cannot be so!" Olwe answers, and the gentle Teleri lord rocks forward, onto his knees, stretches out a hand and gently brushes away a tear as it spills down her cheek. He looks down at his hand, blushing furiously and drops it, pushing backto sit down once more.  "I...I cannot believe such a thing," he said, face still flushed, voice soft. "Children are too precious to us."

"Near the village I last lived there was a waterfall." She turns to the water tumbling into the pool beside where they are sitting. "Much like this one. I used to escape to the waterfall and pretend that I was waiting for my parents to come for me. I never told anyone what I did." She turns back to the water. "I did not believe it when they told me my parent did not love me. I hoped there was some reason they were forced to leave me behind."

Olwe turns his head and looks over at the waterfall, picturing for a moment a young Teleri child, heartbroken, wondering why her parents were not there for her. Slowly he turns back to his friends, and looks at Nole, allowing the pain her words cause to show briefly on his face. "There must have been, " Olwe says quietly. "Know you anything about them, Elenwe? Their name, why they were in Middle Earth?"

Elenwe shakes her head. "No, nothing, my Lord. Nole found their names in the library. That is all I know."

Olwe turns his attention to Nole at her words. Nole returns his king's gaze. "We researched her family heritage in the books of records in the library. We did find out that she has teleri parents," he turns apologetically to his companion, "but I could not find any other information about them. It is a mystery, just like our missing people. They may be among the lost."

 Olwe nods absently, his face deep in thought. Above them, unaware of their conversation or the daily tasks of the Children, Arien's vessel continues its journey across the sky. In the moment of silence, a bird called out and was quiet. "You are here, now, Elenwe, and most loved, " he says finally. "That cannot change the past, I know, but in this moment, you are loved and cherished for who you are, and would never be turned away from your birthright of Alqualonde."

"Maybe they will make their way here someday, such as you and I have, and Apakenwe and Estelin as well. Our people are slowly returning," the sea merchant says optimistically.

A sob escapes her as she hears Olwe's words. "You are most kind, my Lord. Thank you. I have felt loved and accepted from the moment I went on board Nole's ship." She tries to muster a smile. "It is almost impossible to believe they might return one day. You and Nole, and Estelin and Apakinwe, are all my family now. "

Olwe drops his head once more, hiding the pain he feels at the absence of his people. Nole's tone is hopefully, but the silence of the Swanhaven offers a mute rebuttal to that hope.  Would they return? Olwe must wonder, not for the first or last time, and even if they did, would that reunite the Teleri maiden with her lost parents. At her words, he looks up, his eyes showing only affection for this Teleri maiden and for the merchant who has become stalwart friend. "If it is possible to solve the mystery of their disappearance, we shall do so," he promises her, his voice warm.  "We shall do so."

Elenwe smiles at the warmth in Olwe's voice.  "Thank you, my Lord," she whispers.

Olwe smiles back.  "Of course, " he answers.

"I hope the solution to the mystery is not Estelin's cooking. That would drive all of the Teleri away!" The sea merchant laughs aloud.

Olwe bursts into laughter at Nole's words. "True, oh, true, friend Nole.  Although his choice of ingredients is quite," Olwe pauses and seems to search for the words while his face slowly blanches.

"It seems odd he can not cook, and Apakenwe's is not much better" he grins.

Elenwe watches her friends laughing, and can't help giggling herself. "It does seem like things that are easy prove difficult for them. It is very odd."

Olwe gives a inner start at Nole's words. He says quickly, "Well, not all have your ways in the kitchens, my friend."  The Teleri Lord looks over at Elenwe, a little sliver of apprehension in his heart. Yes, despite all attempts, the disguised Vala remain oddly clumsy at the daily tasks that his companions take for granted.

Elenwe furrows her brow. "We speak of Estelin and his cooking. What of Apakinwe? I have not seen her since the dragon came to Alqualonde. Is she still caring for the injured creature?"

Nole blushes at Olwe's words. "I do enjoy my work in the kitchens. But I have not seen Apakenwe either," he says, turning to Elenwe. "I helped tend to the dragon earlier this day, and I have not seen her all day."

Olwe forces his voice to be steady and nonchalant as he answers.  "Yes, the last time I saw her, the lady was, indeed, attending the dragon." He pauses, hearing Nole's words with a sinking feeling in his heart. They were right, of course. Where was Apakenwe?  Estelin has been visible, but of the disguised Nienna, Olwe has seen nothing in the past few days. "The dragon is a rather needful patient," Olwe says, to cover, and it was no less than the truth.  "Perhaps she has gone in search of healing herbs to speed his recovery." He pauses and adds, with feeling. "He eats alot, and Lord Ossy has become overloud in his complaints at being fisher to a 'large worm.'"

Elenwe laughs at the comparison of the dragon to a worm. Nodding, she says, "Oh, yes, I think she said something about that." She looks at Nole. "I have not helped with the dragon, but I would like to. Is it hard? Is the creature friendly? Can I help you?" Elenwe stops and blushes, realizing that, once again, her words are coming much too fast in her eagerness.

Nole nods slightly. "I do wonder what herbs she is searching for, and I am not too confident in her plant identification. Those 'noodles' were certainly not noodles," he says with a laugh.

Olwe is forced to nod in agreement. "I decided not to try to identify exactly what they were," adds the King of the Teleri.  Looking over at Elenwe, he answers her. "Dometis is a kind enough soul, but," he pauses and remembers how the dragon fell into the sea. "He is rather clumsy."

Elenwe's face brightens. "I adore creatures. Can we go see him?" She has forgotten the missing Teleri and the painful memories.

Nole looks up at his king, holding back his laughter before suddenly becoming more serious. "Do you think we should search for her? We should ask her brother."

Olwe masks  an inward lurch at Nole's words. No one else must know the truth of the brother and sister. Outwardly his face is calm as he answers his friend. "Estelin and his sister are still very much strangers to our ways here, it seems, though Teleri there is no doubt, by their appearance." That was, in its strictest sense, the truth. "If she does not return by tomorrow when Tilion's vessel mounts the sky, I will ask Estelin and see what he knows. Truly you are considerate to worry for her. And yes, being a musican, she is more familar with palaces than with woodlands: perhaps we should be a little concerned. But, remember they have travelled much in the world, and seemed to have taken good care of themselves."

Olwe smiles and nods. "Yes, of course, we can see Dometis. "He pauses in his answer to Elenwe, and seems to listen.  All that can be heard is birdsong, the babbling tumble of the water falling into the pool and the gentle swish of the breeze. "He must be awake, for I hear no snores."

Nole nods quickly. "Yes, my king. I  am just worried about her. Perhaps we should see to the dragon then?"

Olwe pushes himself up to his feet, bending down and retrieving his blade.  Turning to Elenwe and Nole, he gestures with the sheathed sword. "This way," he says, and leads them back towards the right directon.  But despite his light hearted tone, a small worry was niggling at him.  Where WAS Apakenwe?

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Arriving at Mandos

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Rhûn Darkmoon and Lihan Taifun

Nienna finds walking easier this morning.  A night's sleep -- rest for the body and the senses -- helped immensely.  Her mind was beginning to sort out "common" from "uncommon" sensations, finding patterns in the stream of experiences.  The new sandals Aulë had crafted for her the night before helped, too.  It had taken her a while to get them fastened properly, even with Aulë's patient help.  But now that they were securely on, they certainly reduced the number of surprising sensations on the soles of her feet.

 Aule is careful to keep his stride measured as he walks next to Nienna.  He could tell from the light link he still kept with her that she was greatly refreshed by the night's rest, but he knew she must not tax herself just yet, and keeping up with the pace of his long legs would certainly have been taxing for the petite Vala.  The frown that had become an almost constant feature of his face in recent weeks deepened.  His mind and body clamoured for him to return to that dark chamber beneath the Halls of Mandos as swiftly as possible. He had to return. He needed to return. Now. This instant. But instead he kept a measured tread, consoling himself that with each step he was drawing closer to where he yearned to be.  This consolation was not enough to erase the frown, however.

Nienna marvels as she walks. So many times she has travelled this route, between her brother's Halls and Manwë's, yet never has the experience been like this!  Every flower is a flash of color and fragrance, every bird calling is a note of music, every blade of grass a tickle on her ankles, Aule himself a solid presence beside her.

Yet a corner of her mind remembers her purpose in travelling with him.  He continues to frown, and indeed it is not likely that one night would cause a Vala would forget whatever is troubling him.  She asks what she hopes is a discretely mild question, to start him talking. "How has your work progressed in Mandos?"

 Aule  is so caught up in his yearnings that he continues to walk on beside Nienna a few moments before her question registers in his mind. When it does, he almost stumbles; so strong is the wash of emotions such a simple question evokes.  His mind replays images of his work in Mandos, the discovery of the mysterious writings, his decision to cleanse the cell, the confrontation with Eonwe, all flash before his mind's eye.  The last causes his frown to deepen even more, if that were possible.  That insolent puppy!  How dare he draw blade to one of the Valar!  The treacherous... With a start he realises he still has not replied to Nienna.  He takes in a deep breath to calm himself but when he releases it, it comes out in a derisive snort. "My work goes well enough." he says, "although not all seem to think so."

Nienna notices the break in Aule's stride, the play of expression across his face, his hesitation before answering.  "How so?" she continues.  "Do some expect the work to go faster?"

Aule gives a short bark of laughter. "On the contrary," he says, 'It would seem some find fault in the fact it went so fast.' The sneer in his voice when he says the word 'some' is very evident.

Nienna turns to look questioningly at Aule, and stumbles a bit as her attention wanders from the mechanics of walking.  "That sounds like a strange complaint.  Who finds fault?"

Aule swiftly raises a hand to lightly steady her as Nienna stumbles. When she is walking steadily again he ponders his reply a moment before answering. What should he tell her?  Will she, like the others, be so ready to judge him badly for his actions? He casts a sidelong glance at her just as those beautiful emerald eyes light up in pleasure as a young fox breaks from cover ahead of them It chases a lowflying butterfly across their path.  The creature gambols and leaps on legs far too long and gangly to control yet in its efforts to catch its 'prey' before suddenly realising their presence and scurrying back into the woods. Watching her wonderment, he remembers the glimpses he'd had of her mind as he had sought the channels for her senses.  No, this one would not be swift to judge him poorly.  Still, his anger at their remembered confrontation is strong in his voice as he answers. "It would seem that my dear brother's upstart Herald dares to find fault with my actions."

The contrast between the fox's playful antics, and Aule's bitter words throws Nienna's mind off balance for a moment.  "Eonwe?  But did not Manwe himself ask you to cleanse that chamber?  Why should Eonwe find fault, if you did what his lord, and ours, asked?"

Aule  shakes his head as he replies. "No, he did not. When I discovered the writings and dark magic in Melkor's old cell I recognised immediately their danger, for no less than six, yes, six of my Maiar were incapacitated by it!  What was I to do? Sit on my hands like a child and put others at risk while I asked what to do about this? Or was I to act like the capable and intelligent being I am and take steps to neutralise the danger to us all?  So I immediately began recording the writings for later study and then cleansing the cell. Haste was of the utmost need.  It was only later that I received word from my brother bidding me that he would send another to do the task.  As if another could do it as well as I!  And that other was none other than his pretty boy Herald, Eonwe.  A herald!  He clearly has a sweet turn to his tongue but what knows he of dealing with dark magic?  In any event, by the time he arrived the work was complete, and his pretty petulant nose got severely out of joint.  He not only dared to find  fault with my actions, but declared me traitorous and drew his blade against me!"

During this outburst the travelers had rounded a corner in their path, and not far ahead lay the entrance to the Halls of Mandos.  At last!  Aule's heart sang with joy at the sight. Soon, so soon now, he would be home at last.

 

Nienna's spirit remains superficially calm at this outburst, as she has trained herself to do during ages of counseling the spirits of the dead.  So she hopes her face does not betray her shock at this petulant outburst.  But what to make of this strange tale?  Inconceivable that Eonwe had acted as Aule described; inconceivable that Aule would lie, or even be mistaken on such a matter.  She was relieved to see the familiar sight of  the massive gates ahead.  In a well-practiced mental gesture, she reaches out a thought of power, commanding the gates to open for them.

Aule's smile is genuine as they pass through the open gates.  Before them at last are the great doors to the Halls of Mandos.  So close!  So close now. He looks down at his companion, sensing the tiredness creeping upon her even after so small a journey. He knew her body would take time to build up the stamina to deal with constant sensory input  Yet still she had not complained once all morning about the strangeness of it all.  Now they had arrived he found himself suddenly loathe to leave her company.  "It has been a challenging journey for you this time, sweet Nienna. Would you join me for a proper meal and some refreshment?"

"And taste other foods?  That would be a pleasure."  Nienna's eyes light in anticipation.  Food has been fascinating, now that she is aware of its flavor and texture.  And, of course, this gives her more time to unravel the mysterious events that are disturbing Aule.

 Aule cannot help but smile at her pleasure.  Gently he takes her hand in hers to lead her forth. "Then come with me, and we shall see what sort of feast we can arrange for your delight."

Aule spots a Maia hurrying to greet them as they enter the Halls of Mandos. "You there!" He gives a curt nod to the Maia. "Send to the kitchens immediately for wine and refreshments to be sent to my chambers. To my NEW chambers, mind. I do hope all my belongings have been moved as instructed?" He pauses long enough for the startled Maia to nod mutely before hurrying on with his list of demands. "I want fresh water to rinse the dust of the journey from our faces, too. Make sure the fires are all lit. Hurry, man, hurry, we don't have all day to dally!" He turns to Nienna and shakes his head. "These people could become fat and lazy if I let them," he says. "Come, let us get you refreshed and off those weary feet."  He takes her hand again to lead the way.

Nienna looks back at the departing Maia.  That was Serelomë, a member of her brother's house.  Was Aule in the habit of ordering other Valar's staff around so brusquely?  What truly was happening here?  Confused, she allows Aule to lead her down the corridor.

The way is unadorned, lit only by a few torches, for few who come this way are wearing physical bodies.  These are the Halls of the Dead, the Halls of Waiting.  They go on, not to the area where a visiting Vala might be lodged, nor to the wide halls where she comforts the spirits of dead elves, but down a stark stone corridor, descending toward the seldom-used dungeons.

Aule continues to measure his stride as he leads Nienna down to the dark chamber.  The slow pace is necessary to match her dainty steps and rather than fretting at the slowness, now that the end is so near, he finds the delay an exquisite torture as the anticipation of finally returning to the embrace of that dark chamber builds.  It would give those lazy Maiar time to prepare things, anyway.  At last the chamber lies before them at the end of a plain stark corridor.  He throws open the doors and beckons her in as he strides forth and breathes deeply.  He tosses his cloak and travel pack aside carelessly and strips his armguards off, tossing them onto the untidy pile of cloak and pack. "Come. There is an ewer of water to rinse off the dust of the road, and look, a humble feast awaits us." He smiles and nods towards the table where a hastily assembled repast awaits them.

Nienna surveys the room.  She herself had never visited the dungeon chamber where Melkor spent eons of imprisonment, but it is easy to see this was no longer a prison.  Fine chairs nestle next to a laden table, set with golden candlesticks.  Carpets cover the rough stone floor.  A well-used writing desk sits in one corner, a sumptuous bed in another.  She frowns at Aule.  "You live here?  Where the traitor dwelt?"

 Aule glances around the room, his eyes regarding it as one might a lover rather than a room of dwelling. "I like it here. It is quiet and away from the bustle of the upper levels.  I find it.. peaceful. When I study my notes on what was written here, I find it helps me connect to them in some way." Aule's voice had become soft and wistful as he spoke, and now he gives himself a small shake, as though bringing his mind back from somewhere far away. "Come, dear Nienna, where are my manners keeping you standing about. Please, take a seat, and let us see what they have managed to find for you to enjoy."

Following Aule's example, Nienna removes her own cloak, which is more of an ornamental piece of cloth, rather than a functional item to keep her warm.  Before yesterday, she had never been aware of the temperature of the air.  She carefully lays the cloak across an unused chair, before seating herself at the table. 

The smell of the food drifts into her nose -- bread, freshly baked this time, and a variety of fruits and cheeses.  She is suddenly aware, not only that she is hungry, but tired as well.  Her legs relax gratefully after two days of walking, and she slumps a bit in the richly upholstered chair.

 Aule courteously pours some wine into a goblet for Nienna. Rather than being pleased that whomever had laid out their meal had taken the time to match a light crisp white wine to suit it, he rather mutters to himself about their fate had they chosen differently.  Filling his own goblet from the flask, he takes a long draught from it before waving it toward the food, "Come, drink, eat. There are pleasures to be found in the food before you, as well as much needed fuel for that mortal body.  You are in need of both, dear friend."

Nienna takes a slice of bread to her plate, and samples of the cheeses.  She sips curiously at the wine -- a fragrance of fruit, a cool taste, sweet, and yet not sweet, totally unlike the water on their journey.  She drinks deeper, and a new sensation rises from inside her body, warm and heavy, nudging her toward sleep.

Aule idly helps himself to a slice of the cheese, selecting one he knew had a strong, pungent flavour.  He is about to take a bite when he feels the wine hit Nienna's system through the control link he still has in place.  His lips curve into a slow smile. Of course, he should have realised. Alcohol would impact her body even more now, and she was tired to begin with.  He opens the link a little more between them to monitor her response more closely.  The cheese lies forgotten on his plate, but he lifts his own goblet to his lips to help hide his smile.

Nienna nibbles at her own bread.  This is even more pleasant than the bread from Aule's pack, soft and tender, still slightly warm from the ovens.  The cheese is nice, too, but she finds it more and more difficult to concentrate on the flavors.  In fact, more and more difficult to concentrate on anything at all.  She yawns.

Enthralled by what he senses through their connection, Aule continues to watch Nienna over the rim of his goblet, his food completely forgotten.  Such sweet innocence of the world touched him greatly. Nienna's head droops.  She catches herself, and tries to continue eating, but focusing on her food is just too difficult.  The table draws closer and closer to her head, and she leans an arm on the table to steady herself.

Aule had sensed this moment approaching as the effects of the food, tiredness and such a draught of heady wine on an empty stomach all combined to take their toll on Nienna's already overloaded body.  As her head nods, he rises quietly to catch her just as sleep overcomes her. Scooping her gently up into his arms he thinks a moment about what to do.  He should take her up to the rooms she usually stays in while here at Mandos.  She was but a featherweight in his powerful arms and the walk back up to the upper levels was no real task for him, even carrying her.  He looks down at her, already sleeping peacefully with her head nestled against his shoulder.  Through the link he could feel her thoughts becoming her dreams, dreams filled with beautiful and innocent things.  He glances around the chamber, once the home of such darkness and thinks again on the doubt and treachery that surrounded him. No, he would not be parted from this one small light of hope.  Turning he strode lightly over to his bed, and with great  care, laid Nienna lightly upon it, making sure she was comfortable and well out of danger of falling off should she move during her sleep.  He stands there for long moments watching her, deep in thought.

Through the deep haze of sleep, Nienna dimly senses her body being settled onto soft cushions.  Clean linen brushes against her cheek.  Smiling, she relaxes into the depths of dreams.

Aule smiles as he sees her settle more comfortably into sleep.  He shakes his head in wonderment that in all these ages he'd never before noticed the sweetness of her innocence.  He gives himself a small shake as the weight of all that had happened in recent times seemed to come crashing down upon him, his body responding with a heavy tiredness of its own.  Stripping off his dusty Jerkin he moves around to the other side of the great bed.  Taking care not to let his movement disturb her, he lies down quietly and watches her sleep, his thoughts drawn to the contrast of her open, honest nature and what he now perceived as the perfidious, disloyal behaviour of his wife.  Troubled thoughts were still chasing each other around in his mind when sleep at last overcame him also.

> Next    

Fireside Chat -- Races: Humans - Part 2

No transcript was kept of “Humans – Part 1”


Present:

Zakar Zamin            

Lihan Taifun            

Belenos                    (belenosstormchaser.magic)

AelKennyr Rhiano  

Summary:

Why did Eru create two similar 'humanoid' races – Elves and Humans? Tolkien thought of “Middle-earth” as our own world in an earlier time, and his writing as providing a “mythology” for the English people. The Elves were intended to help and teach the Humans, until the Humans were ready to take over the running of Middle-Earth. This plan was derailed by the Valar evacuating the Elves to the Blessed Lands, leaving the Humans to fend for themselves. The young race of Humans promptly fell under Morgoth's influence.

The Valar knew that Humans would arrive, and had a rough idea of the time frame. But there is no evidence of the Valar doing anything to look for or help the young Humans. This seems to us negligent, even by Valar standards. The Valar were not terribly good at running the world.

The concept of “adolescent” as a distinct life stage, between “child” and “adult” depends strongly on the culture. In some cultures, especially less-wealthy ones, a person graduates directly from “child” to “adult”.

The Númenorean Humans were given long life as part of their reward from the Valar. The royal house of Númenor, having some elvish and ainur in their ancestry, had especially long lives. By the Third Age, this Númenorean ancestry was getting diluted. Aragorn only lived to 210.

Ainur are difficult to roleplay, to make them “familiar” enough for readers to relate to, but non-human enough to be distinctive. We will discuss “Ainur bodies” at next Tolkien Discussion Group.

Links mentioned:

http://tolkiendiscussion.blogspot.com/2011/04/debate-of-finrod-and-andreth-part-1.html

http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Men

http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/First_Age

http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Fea_and_hroa

http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Ealar

http://forums.theonering.com/viewtopic.php?t=97695

http://forums.theonering.com/viewtopic.php?t=54050

Lihan Taifun:             hello

Zakar Zamin:             Greetings

Lihan Taifun:             you are here to discuss humans?

Zakar Zamin:             Being one, it caught my interest

Lihan Taifun:             ah, a human? indeed? come in, make yourself comfortable

Zakar Zamin:             thankyou

Belenos:                     Hello Zaker.. a new face I believe?

Lihan Taifun:             yes, we have a human here today!

Zakar Zamin:             The topic intrigued me.

Lihan Taifun:             though you might be able to explain the human viewpoint?

Zakar Zamin:             perhapse, I can explain my viewpoint well enough.

{Several “regulars” have been delayed by Real Life.}

Belenos grins.. perhaps, but we do have our resident tolkien expert with us still.. *looks at Lihan*... so she might be able to share some information with us 'ad lib' so to speak?... or we could all just play hookey .. :)

Lihan Taifun frowns. Play hookey when we have a guest?

Zakar Zamin:             Well, I'd like to think that I'm a little more than familiar with his works.

Lihan Taifun:             oh, and a knowledgable guest, at that!

Belenos:                     ohh.. this is even better.. I am but a noob really when it comes to Tolkien, so I'd be most interested in listening to you both.. :)

Lihan Taifun:             ok then! does anyone (meaning Belanos) remember anything from the previous week when Humans were discussed?

Zakar Zamin:             Well, we'll see how much I can dredge up out of my memory.

Lihan Taifun:             I wasn't here, and apparently no one saved a transcript

Belenos:                     erm.. I know I asked a question at the end that we decided to talk about this week.. but i'll be blowed if I can remember what it was now..however, if you give me a couple of minutes I can find the log I expect..

Zakar Zamin mumbles, "Does no one save their logs?"

Belenos:                     yes I keep the logs

Zakar Zamin grins

Lihan Taifun:             I do, but I wasn't here

Zakar Zamin:             Then you're excused, Lihan. „ã°

Belenos grins

Lihan Taifun:             so, we once knew something about Humans ... were we discussing the history of Humans, or how to play them?

Zakar Zamin:             We are a hard, and diverse, target to pin down.

Lihan Taifun:             yes, quite a wide cultural range

Belenos:                     aha! 'what was the purpose of creating man when there were already elves'.. :D

Zakar Zamin:             Ask Eru

Lihan Taifun:             but they were always thought of as a pair, from the beginning

Zakar Zamin:             Despite the years between awakenings?

Lihan Taifun:             from the time of the Great Song, I meant

Belenos:                     thought of as a pair?.. elves and humans?

Lihan Taifun:             the Humans were always in the plan

Zakar Zamin:             Oh, ok

Belenos:                     well see, that's why i asked the purpose..why make the two similar but different types of beings?

Zakar Zamin:             different purpose or function?

Lihan Taifun:             I have to agree with Zakar on that one -- Eru never explained

Belenos:                     ok..

Lihan Taifun:             though in later years, Tolkien speculated that it had to do with their different relationships to time. I don't think I could explain what he was saying, even if I remembered it all

Belenos:                     umm.. how is that different between them?.. how long they live?

Lihan Taifun:             but between the two, they might, theoretically, have lifted Arda Restored out of time into immortality; something about how the Elves "last as long as Arda", but that means they will cease to exist when Arda comes to an end

Zakar Zamin:             From an OOC perspective, if that is helpful, Men need to be accounted for because the world is currently inhabited by them.

Lihan Taifun:             unless the Humans do (or would have done) ... something I don't rememberer

Zakar Zamin:             I don't believe Elves will cease when Arda ends

Belenos:                     so you think Tolkien always intended to imply that the world he wrote about was our earth in another time?

Lihan Taifun:             I think he did

Zakar Zamin:             In a sense, yes

Belenos:                     ok, so then.. what else about humans?

Zakar Zamin:             He was creating an English mythology, because (as I recall) it had been lost due to frequent invasions. This may prove useful: http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Men

Belenos:                     like how a language and culture can be lost through invasions?

Zakar Zamin:             Yes I think I heard that in one of the documentaries on him that I watched

Belenos:                     so if they were destined to inherit and rule middle earth why were they born last?

Lihan Taifun:             The elves were intended to be their teachers, though that plan got messed up when the Valar evacuated the Elves to Aman, so the Humans ended up having to fend for themselves

Belenos:                     oh really?.. I didn't know that

Zakar Zamin:             There are some "why" questions that are beyond our ken

Belenos grins.. sorry about that.. it's my eternal question.. :)

Lihan Taifun:             and it is strongly hinted that the Humans fell under Morgoth's influence almost immediately

Belenos:                     oh really?

Zakar Zamin:             Which would not be a happy day

Lihan Taifun:             no, not happy at all

Belenos:                     the implication then is they were weaker willed than the elves? or more readily corrupted?

Zakar Zamin:             This accounts for our difficulty in doing the right thing... early poisoning.

Lihan Taifun:             or abandoned by both the elves and the Valar

Zakar Zamin:             If the Valar had found us first, who could say what we would have become. Or what if Morgoth had found the Elves first?

Lihan Taifun:             but the funny thing is that the Valar weren't even bothering to look

Belenos:                     I was going to say what's this about finding us? Didn't they know humans were coming? What were they doing at the time?

Zakar Zamin:             Playing with the Elves

Lihan Taifun:             they did know the Humans were coming -- yes, what Zakar said, so busy with the elves, and not paying attention to Middle Earth

Lihan Taifun:             people forget that the Valar didn't do a terribly great job

Belenos:                     and that notion enthralls me.. to think that not one of the valar had time to worry about the humans... Belenos grins.. i wasn't quite going to put it like that.. but yes.. :) so if they helped with creation itself why did they do such a lousy job of looking after it?

Lihan Taifun:             *I* can say that

Zakar Zamin:             When the Elves awoke, they were found by Oromë, as I recall, and they were invited to the Undying lands to live with the Valar.

Lihan Taifun:             for one thing, it was all on-the-job training

Belenos:                     and as we're seeing with Nienna, there was much about mortal life they didn't understand, yes?

Lihan Taifun:             nothing any of the Ainur did, before creation, was any help in how to run a world, or parent races

Zakar Zamin:             I would think, being limited (like the rest of us) the Elves were a handful and a focus of their attention

Lihan Taifun:             yes, I think the Valar really didn't understand the Children

Belenos:                     heh.. elves are ALWAYS a handful.. :D

Lihan Taifun:             the Valar were in the position of parents to the Elves, but what do Ainur know about family relationships?

Belenos:                     exactly!

Zakar Zamin:             Well, they do have a dysfunctional "brother"

Lihan Taifun:             heh heh

Belenos:                     so parents or teachers?... similar but different roles

Lihan Taifun:             or teachers, yes

Zakar Zamin:             I would think more teachers & mentors

Belenos:                     well, they failed at teaching really too.. which is surprising for the amount of time they had to learn how to do it with the elves before humans arrived

Lihan Taifun:             hmmm, and parents aren't?

Belenos:                     parents have more of an emotional involvement don't they? as well as the teaching side of it

Lihan Taifun:             ok, good point. So the Valar overprotected the Elves, resulting in the Noldor stomping off. And then left the Humans alone, resulting in them falling under bad influences

Belenos:                     lol

Zakar Zamin:             Well, one thing to keep in mind. There is a difference between Valar & Elves. It's not the same as adopting a child of your own race

Belenos:                     well yes.. lots of differences really. but how long was an age?.. i mean the elves were around for two, three? ages before men arrived?

Zakar Zamin:             I think an age was marked by a changing event and long a length of time

Lihan Taifun:             yes, First Age was only -- what? -- 600 years?

Zakar Zamin:             I don't remember the lengths http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/First_Age But the wiki might

Belenos:                     hehe.. so the valar were like parents running around wiping the snotty noses of their toddler elves and forgot to change the nappies on their newborn baby called man?

Zakar Zamin:             (I like this website)

Belenos:                     excuse me a moment.. afk

Zakar Zamin:             Well, the Valar did delight with the coming of the elves

Lihan Taifun:             they were really excited about it. then for some reason not so excited about the Humans

Zakar Zamin:             Well, after dealing with the Elves, can you blame them? :D

Belenos:                     lol

Lihan Taifun:             Elves weren't as cute and fun to play with as they expected?

Belenos:                     i mean, can you imagine what they looked like as babies?.. those ears and all. and imagine them as teenagers?

Zakar Zamin:             lol How long is elven adolescence?

Belenos:                     oh gods knows.. compared to human though it would be much longer, yes?

Lihan Taifun:             they often marry by the age of 100, which doesn't explain why Arwen was still single at 2400

Zakar Zamin:             Hard to say... human adolescence varies by cultures... many don't even have it. Going strait from child to adult

Belenos:                     pardon? are we talking about tolkien cultures here or RL cultures?.. sorry... you just lost me

Zakar Zamin:             Both. The only culture where adolescence is described would be Hobits

Belenos:                     ok.. umm.. isn't that rather physically impossible ?... bodies take years to mature from child to adult.. a girl doesn't go from flat chested overnight to barbie proportions... or are you talking about behaviour rather than physical development?

Zakar Zamin:             More social status

Lihan Taifun:             I thought he was talking about cultural categories

Belenos:                     ok.. sorry if I'm slow today.. was up most of the night ... and not enough coffee in the system yet for the brain to function

Lihan Taifun:             yes, one goes from "not old enough to be a legal adult" to "legal adult"; often, for girls, that means "not old enough to marry" to "married"

Belenos:                     so one is considered a child until one is considered an adult.. ok..

Zakar Zamin:             This is a bit OOC: It is in modern, western cultures where we have a period of adolescence... which is getting longer and longer, currently extending into the 20s

Lihan Taifun:             but this is an OOC discussion, so you can say that ;)

Belenos:                     yes.. *smiles* this sim isn't 24/7 Rp sim, Zaker... :)

Zakar Zamin:             ok... I wasn't sure. For an example, watch the movie "Master and Commander". I learned something new.

Belenos:                     well the thing is though, adolescence is getting longer because our lifespan is increasing. in the era of Master and Commander our lifespan was considerably shorter..

Zakar Zamin:             It wasn't that much shorter. Anyway, in the movie, one of the characters is somewhere around 14

Belenos:                     pardon?

Lihan Taifun:             so one of the characters was 14 .... ?

Belenos:                     yes.. it was quite common for young boys to go to sea back then; or go into any trade really... childhood itself was not terribly long lasting. everyone in a family (unless it was wealthy) had to pull their weight to support at least themselves if not the family

Zakar Zamin:             Exactly, and even if we consider lifespan to be half of current - which would've be around 40 - adolescence going from non-existence to 4 to 10+ years. adolescence becomes a societal function allowed by wealth. We, as a society, can afford to let our kids "goof off" until their 20s

Belenos:                     still, the humans of tolkien's time were considerably longer lived even than we are today, yes?

Lihan Taifun:             at least the Numenoreans were

Belenos:                     they don't say anything about the other races of man?

Zakar Zamin:             Just the Numenorians... there were other races that were shorter

Belenos:                     so why were the numenorians longer lived?

Lihan Taifun:             the island of Numenor was a gift from the Valar to the Humans who had fought on the good side in the wars with Morgoth

Zakar Zamin:             They were noble and brought to an island just in sight of the undying lands where the Valar (and elves) live

Lihan Taifun:             the relatively small fraction of Humans who chose the good side

Zakar Zamin:             over the centuries, their lifespan lengthened

Lihan Taifun:             and part of the gift was a long lifespan

Zakar Zamin:             I thought it was due to their proximity to Valenor

Lihan Taifun:             and the royal house was descended from Elros, who was half-elven but chose the Human half, so he and his descendants had an especially long life, even by Numenorean standards

Belenos nods, ok.....

Lihan Taifun:             that bloodline was getting diluted, by Third Age. I don't think Aragorn lived much past 200

Belenos:                     still, that's a worthy lifespan

Zakar Zamin:             210

Lihan Taifun:             I was close

Zakar Zamin:             according to Tolkien gateway

{Belanos is interrupted by phone.}

Lihan Taifun:             pretty soon we will get to how to role-play humans. so you can be thinking about that. I'm not sure whether Fourth Age has any humans right now

Zakar Zamin:             Which is odd, because the Elves were leaving middle at the end of the 3rd

Lihan Taifun:             yes, so there is plenty of room for humans. but I'm not thinking of anyone with a human character

Zakar Zamin:             Should be... unless you want to pattern yourself as holdouts

Lihan Taifun:             oh no, we are trying to adapt and keep up with the world

Zakar Zamin:             So, what races do you represent?

Lihan Taifun:             me and Belanos? or all of Fellowship of the Fourth Age?

Zakar Zamin:             all, or at least the most active

Lihan Taifun:             we are open to any Tolkien races, and fantasy races that are compatible with the Tolkien universe

Zakar Zamin:             Teleri, Noldar??

Lihan Taifun:             yes, we have a lot of elves, and some Ainur, a couple of dragons, a dwarf, a balrog

Zakar Zamin:             I was thinking specifically of the Elves

Lihan Taifun:             the elves of Alqualonde are Teleri, of course. the elves of Sylvhara are a mixed lot

Zakar Zamin:             I don't think I could play one of the Ainur; Somehow, that seems out of bounds

Lihan Taifun:             playing the ainur is hard

Zakar Zamin:             I can imagine... and that is the best I can do, RPing a being who's existence is out of this world, or other-worldly

Lihan Taifun:             yes, as well as the issues of playing a very powerful being.we have a couple of Ainur in disguise in the mortal world

Zakar Zamin:             Playing a powerful being isn't that hard... it is the 'different' thinking that is challenging

Lihan Taifun:             I agree, it is challenging. playing a powerful being without stomping all over everyone else's roleplay is a challenge

Zakar Zamin:             Well, yes. Any Istari?

Lihan Taifun:             the Istari's commission ened at the end of the Third Age, so I'm not even sure what it would mean to be an Istar in the Fourth Age

Zakar Zamin:             I should have said maiar. The Istari were chosen from them

Lihan Taifun:             yes, we have Maiar! Eonwe, Ilmare, Tillion, Arien, a couple of wind-Maiar of Manwe's

http://fellowshipfourthage.blogspot.com/2011/06/eonwe-reports-to-manwe.html

That is from the archives -- a conversation between Manwe and Eonwe. You would have to read the whole story to understand what is going on between Eonwe and Aule; suffice it to say they argued

Zakar Zamin:             The first sentence brings a question to mind: do spirits who cloth themselves with a physical form need to remember to make sweat?

Lihan Taifun smiles. That is a very relevant question. I suspect some ainur do a more detailed job than others

Belenos:                     I'd say that if they use a physical form then it depends on if it's simply an illusion or a literal mortal body

Zakar Zamin:             And if they do, do their "bodies" actually need to sweat?

Lihan Taifun:             I play Nienna. Nienna has just been upgrading her physical experiences

Belenos:                     if it's a literal mortal body then one would assume their bodies behave as most mortal bodies to and regulate themselves.. there is no need to remember to sweat any more than there is a need to remember to breath..

Lihan Taifun:             again, that depends on whether they are just creating the illusion of a body, or an actually, biochemically complete version'

Zakar Zamin:             There was an article I read dealing with the relation between the body & spirit

Lihan Taifun:             it is actually the sort of thing that is important in Nienna's current storyline

Belenos:                     and having piped up with my two second's worth of remarks, now I must make a call to deal with the call I just received.. sorry folks.. RL is being a right pain today

Lihan Taifun:             oh dear, if you must, you must

Zakar Zamin:             RL takes precedence

Lihan Taifun:             the relationship between body and spirit, you were saying

Zakar Zamin:             Lihan, if you are interested, here is the article: http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Fea_and_hroa

Zakar Zamin:             This may be more relevant, but not as informative: http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Ealar

Lihan Taifun:             ah, right, fëar and hroar -- doesn't get into the fanar of ainur

Zakar Zamin:             Ealar

Lihan Taifun:             "fana" is relevant, too -- is there an entry for fana? -- apparently not

Zakar Zamin:             doesn't come up in a search. I think fana & flora, but that is another topic

Lihan Taifun laughs. when ainur manifest a body, it is called a "fana", which is funny, because it is the word for "cloud", but it makes an ainu MORE visible to physical beings

Zakar Zamin:             really. It's not in my copy of the Silmarilian either

Lihan Taifun:             Tolkien used the word "fana" in reference to the Istari's bodies -- which were completely ordinary human bodies, but the same word would apply to something like the shape Ulmo uses when he is talking to people, which sounds more like an illusion. so I am thinking there must be some range of how realistic ainur make their bodies

Zakar Zamin:             finding some interesting things in various forums http://forums.theonering.com/viewtopic.php?t=97695

Lihan Taifun:             interesting. I hadn't seen that before. maybe we could make something of this the topic for next month's Tolkien Discussion Group. we don't have a topic yet

{Ael arrives. Greetings.}

Zakar Zamin:             A lot of people do a lot of thinking on Tolkien's writings

Lihan Taifun:             we love that kind of speculation. we get very speculative

Lihan Taifun:             hello Ael! we were just getting sidetracked about ainur bodies!

AelKennyr Rhiano:   ohh...any bodies I know?

Lihan Taifun:             Zakar asks very perceptive questions. I think it started with whether Eonwe would need to sweat

AelKennyr Rhiano:   Well, I did go on the assumption that sword practice would be more meaningful in a corporeal form, and so a 'body' would have certain physiological needs, regardless that a spirit created that form. Ergo, sweat.

Zakar Zamin:             Someone's analysis: http://forums.theonering.com/viewtopic.php?t=54050 Includes lots of quotes

Lihan Taifun:             I'm trying to leverage this into the September topic for Tolkein DIscussion

AelKennyr Rhiano:   oh...yes, I did look at that when I was preparing for that rp notecard...blushes. I find that it has been very challenging playing a Maia. If you play the character too etheral, then neither you nor the other rpers really have a relationship with the character. There is this absence of investment for me, if that makes sense. But on the other hand, if you play the character "too" mortal, then you have a problem as well.

Zakar Zamin:             I'll bet. Having heard the Music, even being a part of it, you would have an idea of what is going on, or coming, without many particulars

AelKennyr Rhiano nods. But, as we have talked about in our discusson group...how far does that knowledge extend? Does there come a point where what the Ainur know of the song does not extend beyond their current point in history?

Lihan Taifun:             and how detailed is the knowledge?

AelKennyr Rhiano:   Exactly! Lihan is our Tolkien scholar. the rest of us are mere amateurs.

Lihan Taifun:             Zakar has been holding out very well!

AelKennyr Rhiano:   Oh? Now that is a compliment...smiles. So, you are a fan of Tolkien, Zakar?

Zakar Zamin:             As I recall, Manwee has the best view, because of where in Iluvetar's mind he sprang from.

AelKennyr Rhiano nods

Zakar Zamin:             I confess that my memory is enhanced by Google and tolkiengateway.com

AelKennyr Rhiano:   heh heh...You are in good company there :P

Zakar Zamin:             I've read the Hobbit, LOTR and Silmarilian but have yet to read the other books I have aquired. You could say I'm a fan, though not as passionate as the people in the forums

AelKennyr Rhiano:   Cool! At the risk of sounding vain, have you been following our rp?

Zakar Zamin:             I have read some of your RP. Mostly due to time constraints

AelKennyr Rhiano:   I am sure Lihan gave you the blog website :)

Lihan Taifun:             as a sample of how we are handling the ainur

Zakar Zamin:             yes, she did

AelKennyr Rhiano:   nod nod nod She does a wonderful time line and storyline on the site.

Zakar Zamin:             and, to confess, I hardly read the Sylvhara posts either

Zakar Zamin:             And that is where I spend most of my SL time

AelKennyr Rhiano:   I have become a little hopelessly lost on the Sylvhara posts. Wonderful rpers. Great people. I adore Comet. She is Olwe's cousin, you know...winks

Zakar Zamin:             I did not know that I focus on what I'm involved with and ask questions as needed... like I would if there were not postings

AelKennyr Rhiano nods

Lihan Taifun whispers to Zakar: Ael plays both King Olwe and Ulmo and Eonwe

AelKennyr Rhiano blushes

Zakar Zamin:             That is something I have a little difficulty with: playing established characters from the mythology.

AelKennyr Rhiano:   It has been more of a challenge to play Eonwe than to play Ulmo.

Lihan Taifun:             playing original characters is much easier, and we encourage original characters

AelKennyr Rhiano:   Yes, it is, and she is very right. Olwe was easy because so little was truly known about him. Except, as Lihan likes to point out, he is related to just about every other elf. :P

Zakar Zamin:             well, aren't they all related? somehow or another

Belenos:                     backs... *rubs her ear from where it's been flattened by the phone*

{Wecomes.}

AelKennyr Rhiano:   That might be up for debate... The Vanyar did not seem to intermingle with other elves.

Lihan Taifun:             except Indis was Vanya; that makes one

AelKennyr Rhiano:   True, that.

AelKennyr Rhiano nods...yes, it certainly does.

Zakar Zamin:             Which brings another question to mind: Aule only created 7 dwarf lords... how do they procreate?

Lihan Taifun laughs! We have had that topic!

AelKennyr Rhiano:   lol nod nod nodnod

Zakar Zamin:             ok, short answer?

AelKennyr Rhiano:   with short bearded dwarf ladies?

Lihan Taifun:             short answer is that Tolkien drafted about 6 rough drafts of how to write the Dwarf Mothers, and didn't like any of them, so Christopher left them all out of the Silmarillion

Zakar Zamin:             Maybe they just split in two, like a cell.

AelKennyr Rhiano:   Lihan plays a dwarf mother in the 4th Age. Very lovely, too, I might add.

Zakar Zamin:             From Tolkiengateway: The Seven Fathers awoke in their places in pairs with their wives, though Durin I had awoken alone.

Lihan Taifun:             yes, that is the general gist of most of the drafts, though it doesn't explain how Durin became the ancestor of the Longbeard clan of Dwarves

Belenos:                     he hopped a dwarven fence? :D

AelKennyr Rhiano:   omg.....lol